Grande Idea - Endgame - Mafia wins

[iamagummybear]

i have too many towns rip

[jason.mrrown]

huh how come

[iamagummybear]

her solving just feels real? idk i remember when we were all irl together and she was town she made sm statements that were like kinda like “woozy” but she was just town

it feels similar to here

BUT IDK IF IM COPING
i need to backread but i have sm things to do and like i honestly have energy to do nothing

[jason.mrrown]

I mean if daeron (?) is right and misexecuting today will cause the game to end n2, then figuring out meow’s alignment to make sure we’re not miskilling should be a priority

If that’s enough motivation for you

[meow]

some daeron thoughts. I guess he would be my vote preference.

1. push on ash is really blatant. not sure if mafia would be that aggressive, but it happened after marluna revealed spec chat was all sussing ash + jason said he was getting influenced by spec reads, and it feels opportunistic

@Daeron

You have not taken this angle and I am claiming the reason you are not is because you are not a villager

@Daeron

Can you also provide quotes for this? Because this reads as completed fabricated for the purposes of trying to disprove you were leaving open an avenue to ML willow by attacking jason’s reads post

@Daeron

Like the wording of having to ‘concede Jason’s read’ on willow just sounds like ‘I am forced to now townread willow since Daeron has fucking clocked my attempted way to look like I legitimately scumread her’

this bit is kinda towny though:

@Daeron

but if you can provide quotes and convince me that you actually believe that I will consider it

but then it goes back to feeling like daeron is really trying to push ash as the daykill

@Daeron

WHAT bitch you can’t say “I wasn’t leaving an avenue open for misexeing willow and meow because I didn’t scumread and in fact I dropped a slight townread on meow after I did”, to dropping a townread on willow, and then back to “one of them has been miscleared and I will expressly not discuss this until the future when I find it convenient to do so”

2. jason. rereading the jason push, it also feels artificial? @jason.mrrown I guess I’d like to know if you felt the push was in good or bad faith because maybe I’m seeing what I want to see
   this was also right before tutuu showed up and towned jason, so jason was still in a somewhat unstable position.

I had to backread a bit for context, and I’m not 100% sure still, but I think

• ash was sussing gummy and carbon.
• gummy had the ate response that jason and ash felt was unwarranted/unusually defensive
• carbon showed up and sussed ash while townreading gummy in return
• jason found carbon’s support suspicious/opportunistic and made a post pushing her (#384)
• carbon made a response, later jason said he was neutral on carbon

@Daeron

And somehow carbonated remains neutral to jason because:

@jason.mrrown

my carbon wolflean was based quite a bit on the ash-gummy interaction but since gummy has gotten better and ash has gotten a little worse, they’re back to neutral ig

I don’t know how jason has managed to 1. find carbonated neutral after the whole post they made on their slot and 2. find them neutral as a result of other players’ posting but pop off

(the real answer is because they aren’t making genuine reads they’re mafia but I’m talking as if they would be town. like town!jason does not find carbonated neutral after that interaction.)

^responding to 1 & 2: I think carbon no longer being a wolflean (aligned with gummy and unaligned with ash) makes sense given the above context that he started believing in town gummy (therefore townier carbon) and wolf ash (therefore townier carbon).

I don’t really like how jason is automatically assumed mafia in that last statement. Possible I’m misreading what you mean here, and you think jason should be finding carbon town after that interaction?

hey, aren’t you doing what you accused jason of doing on d1 right now?

@Daeron

Let’s take a hypothetical scenario town suddenly starts misreading town!meow - he has got ZERO progression other than his initial read on meow for finding them town so he can straight up say “actually I think they’re mafia now my townread was made 100 posts into the game” and fucking eviscerate her, chop meow up into pieces and make a probably unseasoned stir fry

3. small gummy commentary

can’t tell if this is towny gummy paranoia or mafia trying to see if gummy push viable

@Daeron

btw
gummy is starting to look like mafia that’s having trouble pushing townies because they’re townread and is intentionally ignoring slots because they’re gummy’s partners

[in mafia daeron world, he realizes right after that the push isn’t feasible + justification]. but this set of messages does read as reasonably towny to me in their spontaneity

@Daeron

ok nevermind maybe gummy is just a villager on hard ketamine

@Daeron

sorry im not providing context for all of this

I think gummy’s re-evaluation sounds genuine toward the end of where I was reading but it’s completely fucking so far gone like in another dimension levels of incomprehensible

4. commentary on me / pushes

I find the belief that there are 3 mafia in the setup given 2 additional kills pretty much absurd. I guess I don’t like the urgency like town can’t mess up this misexe, but I’m not sure what that implies – maybe I’d be expecting daeron to be more concerned about the vote/willow or carbon mafia rather than just sheeping?

@Daeron

9 players alive
misexe = 8
night kill = 7
extra KP = 6

3v3

so misexe on meow means game ends if carbonated is maf with an extra vig shot and willow is pushing for a game losing exe

@Daeron

fwiw meow if you are town you should act like your execution ends the game because it most likely does if carbonated & willow are pulling off what they possibly are

@Daeron

oh wait scrap the whole “carbonated and willow are probably partnered if they are doing this” thing

both of them claim a vig so like
it’s almost certain if either are mafia and we misexe we lose tonight
so willow claiming vig on meow is like meh

but then later I guess daeron does start actively pushing me:

@Daeron

im not convinced willow was roleblocked last night which effectively thunderdomes you with them

I started claiming my rb on willow before willow ever claimed to have shot me. how would I have known that willow tried to target me in advance if you think I’m making the rb up?

@Daeron

you have a mafia doctor or a bp you’re lying about

@Daeron

the only scenario where you are willow are both town is where willow is roleblocked, or one of you is lying as town
the second is incredibly unlikely
the first is more likely but ehhhh

@Daeron

okay there’s a third
and that’s that a mafia doctor targets you as town

so you think all of these scenarios are more likely than me choosing willow as my target n1? I was already suspicious of her by d1 eod. what about scenarios where willow is a neutral that needs to exe me?

5. potential partners

@Daeron

if I am mafia who are my partners?

@Daeron

literally everyone who suspects me has you as my partner in every world

okay everyone who had suspected you is literally just gummy I think

first I’d think willow given how much you’re supporting her/have been one of the main willow town vouchers, but I don’t think she can be mafia unless you guys are known for crazy plays like this, doesn’t make sense

then I was thinking marluna, and I think it could make sense, but it’s mostly that I don’t see any reason why it wouldn’t work.

I can’t really see you paired with carbon with how you reacted to carbon’s dayvig play if you had been involved in it
I can’t see jason at all (pushed him too hard)

maybe gummy? @iamagummybear what made you townread daeron?

tutuu would be. a world. I could almost see it. but tutuu strikes me as a optimizing mafia type who would just kill active townread posters and not reduce poe, and I think n1 hazard to frame carbon/me/willow would be uncharacteristic. but I can also see the world where tutuu thinks that killing an active townread poster (in this world, gummy, me, or jason) with consensus poe would draw some level of pk meta suspicion on them and hazard works as a really good way to reframe d2 discussion. I think I’m tunneling too much on this though because probably easier to just push hazard hard d2 instead?

so I think I end up with vibewise/people who have townread you or you have townread: willow > marluna > gummy > tutuu > carbon >> jason
but more realistically with what’s happened: marluna >> tutuu??? = gummy?? = willow? >> carbon = jason

[meow]

oh man that just posted as a reply rip

[iamagummybear]

@jason.mrrown

should be a priority

look point blank
school is my priority

[meow]

I CAN LIKE AGAIN REJOICE

[meow]

@zoethepenguin thought I had – maybe ask if mafia innocent child or town traitor is play? could clear two people

[iamagummybear]

@meow

maybe gummy? @iamagummybear what made you townread daeron?

literally j the fact he put so much effort in his longposts
i asked him for a mafia game of his but he didn’t respond with one

[iamagummybear]

what is town traitor

[iamagummybear]

@meow are you sure you’re not mafia

[iamagummybear]

LOOK ME IN THE EYES AND TELL ME

[meow]

anyway I put off dinner to finish this it took longer than I expected again despite it just being me copypasting almost everything daeron’s ever posted (I appreciate that it’s like content-dense for the number of posts), so please discuss and tell me I’m tunneling

[meow]

you tell me

(unless I randed some role that makes me think I’m something I’m not)

[jason.mrrown]

Man i’m p woozed by this tutuu sheeping of hazard’s legacy

To begin with, i’m still doubting that hazard was killed for his reads, due to hin having low threadpull. He had willow and meow as small townleans that he wasn’t confident about and carbon/ash/pandora as poe. Imo if hazard was like hardpushing for meow the previous day then it would be a different matter, but this is like such a leap in logic.

And to top it off tutuu decides to trust daeron and gummy on their townreads on willow and carbon. If anything, if tutuu really was sheeping legacy, surely he would trust the reads of a flipped townie over two people who’s alignment he’s unsure of and push carbon?

And this leads to tutuu trusting gummy and pushing meow, who hazard had a small townlean on.

Idk this feels really really bad to me.

[iamagummybear]

UNVOTE meow

[meow]

same as mafia innocent child but shows up as town and no guilt clause if the role has a guilt clause I think?

[iamagummybear]

i think hazard was killed for rolefishing + he’s known as a solid player

[iamagummybear]

aren’t you asking zoe to clear herself then