17776th poster gets a cookie (cookie thread (Part 7)) (Part 11)

General
#13570

So is Virtuous shortform or a novelty?

2 Likes
#13571

Fakeclaiming is fun and a test of interesting skills and such. PR strategu is fun

1 Like
#13572

a novelty

1 Like
#13573

born of tol copium

1 Like
#13574

…but you could play it shortform and it would work

probably better than longform :skull:

2 Likes
#13575

Yes
it absolutely is better in shortform ill level with you
but it has enough mechanics to become a fucking monster of a novelty

1 Like
#13576

oh absolutely
reads based on mech is cool as well
i greatly appreciate things that can do that

… they’re just not common in most mech.

#13577

What

1 Like
#13578

IDK I think most mech includes reads and interesting decisions

1 Like
#13579

if people played virtuous >5 times and gained a full understanding of it it would quickly fall off except in shortform, where there is simply not enough time to go through every class

1 Like
#13580

key word being Interesting
i don’t think most basic roles provide interesting decisions most of the time
reads, maybe

#13581

I am in Prophylaxis’s Frieren game as the Tracker. snow is executed after a tie with tutuu.

I have the read that w!tutuu ~always believes themselves to be the optimal candidate to carry the nightkill after having so much heat taken off them by the tie, so I decide to track tutuu. This is a mechanical read, it’s a read that can only exist because of mechanics, but still a subjective/interesting judgment to make, and it introduces a skill that mountainous can’t test.

Since tutuu doesn’t visit the nightkilled player, I get to pseudo-clear tutuu, because I think that w!tutuu would basically always decide to carry it there.

That’s super basic mech and it still induces stuff that’s valuable as more than just “oh something to talk about”

3 Likes
#13582

(And then it’s revealed there was a moderror and this was completely wrong)

5 Likes
#13583

Or even like. The potential existence of a doctor allows for significantly more varied wolfplay than a purely mountainous game, because wolves in a mountainous game have to explain why they have not been nightkilled every single night in a way that can’t fully be waved away by “oh WIFOM it was to make me more sus”. This means that you can’t try to obviously outplay the entire playerlist in mountainous as wolf, and can even make games extremely difficult to win for specific people on specific playerlists because them not being nightkilled is such a huge fucking drag on their gameplay

If there is any potential of kill protection, the range of wolfplay is significantly expanded, because it becomes riskier to kill the power players and thus wolves can be power players without being immediately suspect for surviving

2 Likes
#13584

in hindsight i was specifically complaining about cop my bad

3 Likes
#13585

IDK it’s a pet peeve of mine that people see roles as “impurities” in mafia that we only tolerate to have more variety or whatever.

Even if you make a closed-setup game and then make every player a VT, the gameplay gets more interesting in a lot of specific ways that aren’t impurities to the social gameplay of mafia. They’re features! They let you do more things! Socially!

3 Likes
#13586

(I dont think you see roles as impurities I think marissa does because she said it)

1 Like
#13587

I Don’t Hate Cop there’s counterplay to cop it’s called Don’t Get Copped

1 Like
#13588

This is biased by the fact that I’ve had a bunch of extremely fun moments in mafia as a result of the existence of cops

1 Like
#13589

it’s called “snipe the cop n1 which holds up the entire setup by being the only strong power role in an 11v4 and sweep because of it”

3 Likes